Topic: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

So I'm about to go off and watch "Ghost Rider: Spirit Of Vengeance", largely because Cage is the star. I am inexplicably drawn to Nic Cage. There's something about his overall instability in a film that excites me. He could be mid-line in a dramatic scene and suddenly explode into a spastic overacting tantrum of awesome. I have gone out of my way to watch movies that I know would end up being terrible simply because Cage is in it.

And everyone else hates him for some reason.

The reasons I most commonly see for people hating on Cage is his weird hair, his involvement with The Wicker Man and his penchant for suddenly screaming at people for no particular reason. But I have the exact opposite reaction to those stimuli. I want to know if there's some way to quantify this. I know there are a few other people like myself who actually like this sort of thing. I want to know if there's some kind of pattern to this. Something that people like myself and Brad Jones have in common.

We both kinda like cheesy flicks and B-movies. We're both fans of the Asylum. But not really in an ironic sort of way. It's not like these things are so bad they're good. Rather, they make a certain type of movie, and we can allow ourselves to ignore the badness and actually enjoy the movie as it was intended to be enjoyed.

Example: US Seals 2. I will absolutely agree that it's a terrible film and only makes sense if you've recently suffered severe head trauma, but I consider it to be one of the better action films I've ever seen. Not only can I enjoy the movie in an ironic sort of way (the phone-call scene, the "I always loved you" scene), but I genuinely like the action and the overall fun mood of the movie. I think a lot of 80's action movies basically have the same tone. You allow them to get away with stuff that doesn't make sense because the part of your brain that's getting off on the action and fun is getting so much stimulus that it's drowning out the part of your brain that's more concerned with whether or not any of it is making any amount of sense.

This movie I'm about to go see currently sits at 15% on Rotten Tomatoes, and less than 50% audience rating. That's heinously bad, and I would normally avoid a movie with that sort of rating like the plague, especially an action movie. But I can't, because I know a lot of that rating has to do with Cage, and a lot of it probably also has to do with Neveldine/Taylor, who are an acquired taste on their own. I wasn't a fan of Gamer, but I liked the two Crank movies - the second more than the first, if I'm being entirely honest. Again, I know those movies are bad in a general sense, and the first Crank is the better movie if you're rating them on general film-making terms, but I like them.

My problem here is that every time I go to a Nic Cage movie, I end up thinking about this sort of shit. I question why people don't like Cage. It's honestly a completely foreign thought for me. I cannot conceive of what it would be like to not love Nic Cage. I seriously doubt that it's his hair or crazy-ass acting that turns people off. I've had guys tell me that it's cause he plays the same character in every movie, and that's OK to a certain point, but I don't honestly believe that. He's got his own quirks that show up in a character, but a lot of his characters are played differently. He's not been in buttloads of shitty movies, either. He's had his fair share, I guess, and a string of them in the mid 2000's, but his worst movies are just kinda mediocre. Only a couple of them are actually "bad" and not "bland".

Fuckin...  I dunno.

Explain! Why do people hate Nic Cage so much, while a small group of us actually love the shit out of him? And is this common? Are there any other actors who are almost universally hated but are adored by a small subset of people?

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

I've said it on the show: I love Nic Cage.

Teague Chrystie
Twitter | Facebook

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

Despite all my rage, I am still just Nicolas Cage.

Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

Nic's ok,.. but this is his problem....

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"Life is about movies; anything else is a bonus!"- Me   cool

Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

Love that video. Sometimes College Humor knocks it out of the park.

Anyway, I like Nicolas Cage a lot. He's unapologetic about what he does, and you've gotta respect that on some level.

"Doctor Submarine judges us from on high." -Teague

Twitter | Popcorn Culture, for my movie reviews.

Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

I also quite like Uwe Boll...

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

I'll be honest, here... If someone wrote "Schindler's Fist" and offered it to me, I would totally say yes to that. I kinda wanna write that myself.

EDIT

I hate Uwe Boll. His movies are just bad, in the same way that the Transformers movies are nigh unwatchable for me. Like...  most of the Asylum films know what they are and have fun with whatever concept they're using to make a movie. Sherlock Holmes, for instance. Fucking Iron man and mechanical dinosaurs in that movie. It's beyond awesome. When hollywood does that stuff, it ends up coming off as insulting. They want to make a big stupid action movie like that and have it be fun, but they assume that the people who watch that stuff are borderline retarded, so they make their film for morons. They explain things that are happening on screen and make sure to restate the plot over and over. Stuff like that.

Boll goes one further and seems to take a weird pleasure in flat-out telling his audience how dumb they are. Some of his films can be kinda funny to watch, but he doesn't like movies. He likes money, and he's found a way to make loads of it. If they were to ever cut off his little funding scheme - which they may do what with all the economic problems they're having over there - he would quit making movies and do something else. The only thing he's ever made that wasn't too hard to watch for me was Rampage, and that movie was about 60 minutes too long. Woulda made for a great 15 or 20 minute short film. Not at all a cheesy action short though. It would actually be kinda haunting. But I tend to avoid his movies cause I just frakking hate his guts on a personal level tongue

Skyline, tho. That movie was fun and cool and cheesy and stuff and felt honest about it. I guess that's really the key. There's a difference between laughing at a movie and laughing with it, and it's just some sense that you can get from a movie when it's saying "Yeah, it's OK to laugh at this, cause this is corny as hell" as opposed to "This is so over the top and cool! I'm trying SO HARD right now!" and failing at it. The fact that the aliens are sucking out people's brains - whole - with little vacuum-mouth things would feel dumb in a movie that was trying to be too serious about what was going on, like if they were doing that in Transformers or something, but is cool in a cheesy sort of way in a movie that hits the right balance of cheese and not-cheese. On purpose. Skyline didn't go far enough with it, I think, but got close, but that might be why people reacted so negatively to it. It wasn't in that sweet zone of cheesy fun that few movies manage to hit perfectly.

Take that sort of film-making to an extreme and you end up with Black Dynamite. Don't take it far enough and you end up with some of the Asylum's earliest movies and some of their less-entertaining movies. Right in the middle is where the true cheese masters stand proudly. The Evil Deads. The Sherlock Holmes. The US Seals 2 and Ninjas.

Last edited by Squiggly_P (2012-02-21 01:16:30)

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

Nic Cage is great. Nic Cage's movies largely suck, but there's no telling about them. National Treasure: ridiculous but fun. Ghost Rider: aggressively bland. Season of the Witch: kind of dug it. Wicker Man: bizarrely terrible. Lord of War: dull. Family Man: surprisingly watchable. Gone in 60 Seconds: a terrible film made by bad people who don't understand the first thing about the low-budget original.

Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

Ya, I don't get the Nicholas Cage hate either. He's an awesome actor, and he almost always makes the movies he's in better, even when they're not very good.

Outlaw Vern coined the phrase "Mega-acting" when talking about Cage, because over-acting implies that it's a negative, and what Cage is doing is intentional and makes the scene work better.

That being said, I wish he didn't have debt problems, because he's taken a lot of shit movies on these 2 years clearly for the money. I hope his finances are better so he starts having more hits than misses again.

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

So Ghost Rider: Spirit Of Vengeance is pretty much what you'd expect a PG13 Neveldine & Taylor flick to be. Lots of weird stylized bits, shots that are only in there to be cool/funny moments, lots of cheesy stuff, etc. There were some moments where I really wanted the movie to head into full-on R-rated territory, and I think the movie had it's balls cut off by a lack of gratuitous nudity, violence and cursing, but it's a fairly fun movie.

The visual for the Rider is much much better, but the rider does some exceptionally weird shit and behaves... oddly. Usually just long enough to where you think to yourself "this is kinda weird what he's doing right now..." and then he flings a chain at someone and kills them. So there's that.

I think I know why people hate this movie, tho. It's extremely anticlimactic. I don't want to spoil anything, but if you've seen the trailers, you've effectively seen the whole movie, minus one fairly cool car chase / fight and a couple of scenes featuring one of the bad guys.

Overall, it's kinda dumb and extremely easy to follow along with on account of the lack of any sort of plot twists or turns or anything. Predictable as hell. The acting for the most part is fairly crap with some exceedingly bad line delivery in most every scene. It's not 15% rating on RT level bad, but it's not good.

Nic Cage, however, is having fun and Nic Caging all over the place in this movie, though not at an exceptional level. There are a few really funny little moments in there as well (no one laughed,tho, so maybe it's just me). It's mediocre at best, but still better than the first one. There were a couple of "OMG our audience is dumb!" bits, tho, that annoyed me.

Overall I'd give it 2 or 2.5/5 stars as a film, but a 65% on the Nic-Cage-O-Meter.

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

I'll be honest, I kind of really hate Neveldine and Taylor, and their entire "Who gives a shit" approach towards film-making. I kind of like the first Crank (mainly cause Statham brings it in that), but I've hated everything else they've done, and I pretty much side with Drew Mcweeny: http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/motion-capt … -ever-made

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

I don't think it's worse than Elektra. It's not good, granted, but it's at least got a few things going for it - namely cage taking a few scenes and running with them.

The only really 'incomprehensible' thing about the movie is how people can apparently know where they need to go without really knowing where they're supposed to be going. People will just show up out of nowhere because that's where they're supposed to be. That's the only major plothole going on, tho. Everything else makes sense, so far as a guy whose head is usually a skull on fire can make sense in a movie. There was never a point where I was like "huh!? But why would they do that if they want this..." etc. The goals were pretty clear for all parties involved. In fact, they were so clear that there was a point where it wasn't believable that the other characters didn't know what some other guy was planning on. So there's that...

The thing that these two really need to learn is that an action sequence is only as good as it's entry and exit points. If the action sequence doesn't do anything for the story, then it's pointless and shouldn't be in the movie. A good action sequence should affect the characters in some measurable way, beyond just altering the mechanics of the plot. If you're not gonna use the action to genuinely affect the characters, then you need to use them to up the stakes. The Crank movies did that, but this movie did not, mainly because the main character is - for all intents and purposes - immortal.

You gotta go for the character-affecting angle on a movie like this, cause there's no real way to up the stakes without taking the focus off the Rider, and if you do that then you should grow the character you shift the focus to. In this case it would be the kid and his mom, neither of whom seem to grow or change in any way by the end of the film. The only real character growth is Cage's eventual acceptance of what he is - which doesn't really feel like it's given any sort of real motivation or setup:

Spoilers:

  Show
He spends the first half of the movie talking about how he wants to get rid of the rider, then he finally gets rid of it, and then a couple scenes later he's in danger and he's all "well shit, I guess I need that power back..." and then he gets it back. There's no period where he doubts himself, no period where he's overjoyed of being rid of the demon (unless you count like 5 seconds where he basically says "hurray!") and no point where he weighs the consequences of being the rider against the benefits. The lack of internal conflict is a problem, cause that's the sort of thing that generally happens when you've got some kind of character growth / arc going on. If there's no conflict, then why change?

I'd say that Mr McWeeny seems mostly annoyed by the hyperactive editing and all the weird visual effects that are going on throughout the film. When the 'decaying' guy shows up to kill someone, everything goes away and all you see is just him and whoever he's killing on a black screen. There's stuff like that going on throughout the movie, but it didn't bother me. The Rider himself has some...  unique moments and effects that are impressively odd, but not enough to drive me out of the movie. Maybe it should have, but it didn't.

It's like that game Assassin's Creed. When you kill a target in that game, you sorta exit reality and enter this nether-region where you have a five minute conversation with the guy you just killed before he dies, complete with the guy walking around and 'acting' and such. It's fucking bizarre the first time it happens, but you get used to it. They're just doing a thing, and that thing becomes part of the fabric of the game. I would consider most of the weird shit in this flick to be on par with that sort of thing. I figure they were trying to visualize an all-consuming, overwhelming sense of dread. Technically, since this guy is supposed to be a character called "Blackout", dousing the lights is something he's just able to do. They took insane liberties with him, tho, so he's not really the same character.

I will give him the cardboard characters and crap plot 'twists' bits, tho. That is absolutely the case. The only character that has any sort of arc is Cage's, and his arc is kinda baffling, as I mentioned.

It's not 'good'. I would say I liked it better than the Fantastic Four films and Electra / Daredevil in that I could sit through it. I nearly walked out of Daredevil, and have yet to watch those others all the way through without shutting it off midway. I would say it's "entertaining", but it's really only that if you're into Cage's brand of crazy and occasionally neat imagery. The action is fun at times, but not anything worth paying money to see.

And the 3D wasn't so bad, though there were times when I wanted to grab the camera and hold it still. Also, if you're ever making a 3D movie, DO NOT SNAP-ZOOM! I almost got fucking whiplash a couple times from my head suddenly jerking backward because the entire world moved ten feet closer to my face in an instant.

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

bullet3 wrote:

I'll be honest, I kind of really hate Neveldine and Taylor, and their entire "Who gives a shit" approach towards film-making.

Yup. Gamer is one of the worst films ever made in my opinion. Horrible, ghastly, hate-filled flick. At least the Crank films are somewhat charming in their own way (though, give me the first Crank over the sequel any day).

I have no intention of seeing the Ghost Rider sequel even though I like Cage.

Last edited by Jimmy B (2012-02-21 11:19:21)

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Re: Nic Cage is eating my brain. Someone help me.

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