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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

I was (mostly) rolling with Elysium just fine until the third act, when it went right off the rails.   None of the payoffs made sense and I couldn't help but start thinking of all sorts of better ways to go with them. 

And the final ta-dah! completely undercut the entire premise by showing that the central issue that drove the entire plot could have been easily solved from the very beginning.

I'd go into detail, but I'm hoping Elysium will be very high on our to-do list when we re-convene after the holiday so we can really get into it.

I know, right?    I dunno if that's how it happened, but I can imagine one of the Coens happening to see that album and getting an idea... smile

SPOILER Show
Just to make sure, I just rewatched the DVD. Everyone does and says and wears exactly the same things in the beginning and end scenes, just seen from different angles and with more of the events shown.

As for the Dylan thing, I took that to mean that Llewyn's never going to "make it", in terms of achieving fame and fortune.  It's sort of up to the viewer to decide if that's because of the flaws in his character, or just colossally bad luck.    Starting the movie at the end (without showing us Dylan yet) works for me that way - Llewyn's story is already over, he and we just don't know it yet.  But we get it the second time through, now that we know Dylan is about to break.

Also, Llewyn's story is at least a little bit based on the life of Dave van Ronk, who was very influential in the folk scene and actually mentored Dylan and others.  He never got famous outside the folk scene, but people IN that crowd say he was one of the greats.   

"Hang Me O Hang Me" was one of van Ronk's signature tunes.  Also, this pretty much nails it... smile

http://www.nextmovie.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Van-Ronk.jpg

But really, I find the ending still sorta hopeful in its way.  Like van Ronk, I see Llewyn as a guy who eventually will be remembered as one of the greats, even if only in retrospect.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Yeah, I don't get the hoopla about that song either.  Haven't seen the movie but I saw that clip that everyone was going gaga over.  Song was okay, but what threw me was that the character animation was kinda sub-par.

Again, haven't seen the whole movie, so maybe that scene works better in context.

Two things:

SPOILER Show
I haven't seen this "controversy" about the Gorfeins, but it's a silly controversy - the Gorfeins are definitely Llewyn's dead partner's parents.  In typical Coen fashion they just never say it directly, but show it in context via all the clues you mention.   

Not to mention the simple fact that there's no other reason LLewyn would know people like the Gorfeins, or for them to want to help him.  But it makes perfect sense that they would cling to LLewyn as their surrogate for their lost son... and for him to be uncomfortable and conflicted about that.

The ending isn't the same thing happening twice, it's just the same scene twice.  The movie starts with the ending and then jumps back in time.    Again, it's just typical Coen behavior NOT to give us a title card that says something like "Three days earlier" at the point the movie makes the jump.

Chronologically, the story starts with Lllewyn waking up at the Gorfein's and accidentally letting the cat out.  The story proceeds from there until he's back at the Gorfein's again (after heckling the singer whose husband will be beating him up).  This time he doesn't let the cat out, and goes to the club. Then we see the ending in  context - this time slightly expanded to include Dylan and other details, like the attacker mentioning the reason for the attack.

I agree that the idea is that Llewyn is stuck in a loop, just not a literal one where the attack scene happens twice. smile

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(34 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Jean Shepherd, who wrote the book the movie is based on.   In God We Trust, All Others Pay Cash

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Ewing wrote:

I have a remedy for that.

SO much better!

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

I have not seen SERIOUS MAN, actually.  smile   And to be fair the "non-ending" of NO COUNTRY still made a kind of sense to me, since it sorta fit with what the movie seemed to be saying overall.    I was more bothered by the non-ending of THERE WILL BE BLOOD that same year, to be honest.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

I don't know if I'd say Top Three, but I agree the Coens are among the best we have right now.   Whether I love a particular movie of theirs or not, I always find their stuff to be fascinating and beautifully crafted.

For example, INSIDE LLEWYN DAVIS is just great from beginning to end - my only disappointment is that it doesn't have much of an "ending" and I tend to prefer a conventional story with a resolution.   Really, that's about the only thing that separates Coen movies that I love from ones I just admire.

So HUDSUCKER, ARIZONA, LADYKILLERS, yay.  NO COUNTRY, LLEWYN DAVIS... wait, that's it?  You're just stopping there?  smile

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Ewing wrote:

Are there any directors from the past 30-ish years that you enjoyed more after their debut film?

Sure.  Peter Jackson, Cuaron, and del Toro are three that come immediately to mind.   They didn't bust out of the gate with a game-changing smash, they showed promise early on and then worked their way up to the really good stuff.

Jimmy B wrote:

Shaun of the Dead was actually Edgar Wright's second feature length movie. His first, A Fistful Of Fingers is rubbish by most accounts. ( it was released theatrically briefly in the UK and reviewed in magazines and TV shows at the time so it counts).  *runs away*

I did say first film they really wanted to make... smile   The Coens and Anderson (and Lucas etc for that matter) also made movies before their big breakouts, my point is just that they hit it big very early in their careers.   Again, as opposed to some other folks who put out movies for a decade or more before hitting their golden era.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Sure it does.  And for the same reasons. smile

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Shaun is still my fave Wright film too, by a country mile.    And Boogie Nights is my favorite PT Anderson, and Raising Arizona my fave Coen movie...    All of which - hmm, this might be important - were their early breakout hey-who-is-THIS-guy(s)? movies.

In all cases, for me their movies since then have been more "I see what you did there" than "I am entertained by what you did there".    Sometimes there's just something special about the energy when the new guy (or gal) gets their first shot at making the movie they really want to make.

Often they go on to make lots of money and even win Oscars, but still there's some spark that's not quiiiite there anymore.

*See also Spielberg, Lucas, Scorcese, Spike Lee, Shyamalan...

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

My Coen like-list varies pretty widely as well.  Liked Hudsucker a lot.  Not big on Barton Fink or Miller's Crossing.  Liked The Man Who Wasn't There.  Lebowski is fun but I don't worship it like some do.  Fargo... I get it, but don't love it.  True Grit and O Brother, loved.   Raising Arizona is still my #1.

as for The World's End... yeah, put me in the camp of not-a-big-fan.   Pegg's performance is pretty great, but the rest of the movie is just sort of... loud and busy.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

It's bona fide.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

I assume you haven't seen Raising Arizona, then?   Because the alternative is too terrible to contemplate.

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

I'm with Doc Sub on this one - I liked Three Kings, and Silver Linings Playbook whenever Jennifer was onscreen, and that's about it for me and David O. Russell as well.

American Hustle wasn't bad, it just seemed like a Goodfellas fanfilm.  I also don't get the appeal of Bradley Cooper, so that may be part of the problem.

Doctor Submarine wrote:

Next summer...GRAVITY 2

Gravity 2: Antigravity

I just want to be in the room when that gets pitched to a studio. 

They'd be eating that up and then... "Wait - then what happens?  I see.  Well, thanks for coming in."

Dorkman wrote:

I'm not sure why we're talking about artistic integrity when the article is just about the Tolkien estate getting screwed on the back-end points.

The article talks about Tolkien's family being unhappy with creative changes as well.   

But of course, who'd write an article about an author who was thrilled with a movie adaptation and thought the paycheck was awesome and completely fair?   That ain't gonna get no clicks.  smile

Eddie wrote:

By all actual documentation, PL Travers was NEVER going to be happy with any version of it.  She never wanted to make it into a movie and only relented because she needed money.  Walt was a ridiculous fan and wanted to do right by it.  I'm wont to defend Disney often, but I think she was so disgusted with herself by selling out that any movie would have been fruit from a poisoned tree.

And there's the irony - the reason Saving Mr. Banks sorta works is that we know how it turned out.  So every time she tries to stop Walt from changing her work she's trying to stop a beloved movie classic from being made omg oh noes.     She doesn't want it to be a musical????   Well, what does she know?    No animation??    What a bitch!

And meanwhile, PJ is a monster because an author's every word is sacred harrumph harrumph!  smile

Just occurred to me that Saving Mr. Banks is an entire movie about this exact thing - except that movie wants us to cheer for the corporation when it successfully undercuts the original writer's intentions.   smile

See also: Producing tv shows...

Frank Darabont sues AMC claiming loss of profits

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(209 replies, posted in Off Topic)

Aaaaand can now cross American Hustle off my "to see" list.  Had high hopes but it just didn't do much for me, other than further solidify my belief that Jennifer Lawrence is awesome in everything always.

Sadly, my favorite part was that all the production company logos at the beginning were done in various '70's styles.

Everybody involved has already made more money than all of our lifetime salaries combined.   They either want even more, or want to give away less.

There's an old Hollywood joke that goes:  What's the difference between the producer of a hit movie and the producer of a flop?
The producer of a flop makes a lot of money.
The producer of a hit makes a LOT of money.

That's why these deals get made.  Everybody gets rich, then they can afford to quibble over who gets richer.

Well, nobody sues a flop movie.  There's no money in that.

/Still waiting for my cut of that sweet, sweet John Carter cash