Topic: Inglourious Basterds poll.
Feel free to elaborate on your stance, but simply speaking, is it a movie that you like.
I have a tendency to fix your typos.
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Feel free to elaborate on your stance, but simply speaking, is it a movie that you like.
I do. Not perfect, but its very fun and lyrical, if slipshod and a lot like trying to transport large quantities of soup in a burlap sack.
No. I like a number of scenes and some characters, but I feel like this particular mixtape didn't have the flow of some of QT's prior work. I don't have a boiling hatred for it but I could probably go the rest of my life without watching it again (although I'm sure I won't, since sooner or later we're sure to DIF it).
Wait, I think you've come up with a new tshirt idea- "Down in Front: DIF-ing movies since 2009"
Nah, I only liked one of the characters in this and the first scene seams to be the only one that's well put together. But I saw it sorta half-baked so... I don't know how much I can trust my own assessment of the flick...
I just didn't understand what it was about. Why were the Americans acting evil and succeeding at everything? It was like Death Wish except Charles Bronson doesn't just shoot street thugs, he tortures and mutilates them. And they didn't kill his family; they're just petty criminals. And no one really tries to stop him. And the main villain who really actually is evil has no idea who Bronson is until they meet at the end, and then they make a deal. And then Charles Bronson pretty much welshes on the deal.
It was just a weird, totally amoral revenge fantasy dreamed up by a 9-year-old. "And then... they kill Hitler!" Um. How do you square that with the history books? "What? Hitler is dead, right?" Right, but we know this isn't how he died. "I haven't read any history books. I'm only nine."
I wouldn't want all movies to be like this but i wish there were more of them. It's well made and well acted. To me, nothing about it is slipshod and 'mixtape' talk is a little unfair. It's more original than that.
It doesn't have the flow of some earlier stuff because it's more European, which is ok. The milk farmer scene's slow on purpose. Not like the end of Pulp Fiction where it's full of tension because Jules explains his philosophy, it's just plain slow at the beginning cuz it wants to be the opposite of Transformers 2. I enjoyed the performances of Christoph Waltz, Diane Kruger and Mélanie Laurent in a different way than Sam Jackson, Bruce Willis and Uma Thurman but just as much.
The revenge ending is too fucked up for me. Not a huge fan of Death Proof because of the revenge angle also. I disagree Zarban, there is no "why." This is an alternate universe story. The American solders are weird because they've never existed like this, and in what-if-Jews-shot-Hitler-in-the-face world that nazi doesn't get to live a cushy life in Long Island without Jewish Brad Pitt carving a swastika on his forehead first.
I've always thought of movies as either art (like Alien) or not art (like Aliens). Not art isn't necessarily a bad thing, in fact i usually prefer to watch Aliens. One of the reasons I like Basterds is because it's art. The Hurt Locker didn't deserve to sweep best picture/director/orig screenplay over this.
Martin Scorsese sez: "[Stanley Kubrick's] films were initially misunderstood. Then, after five or ten years came the realisation that 2001 or Barry Lyndon or The Shining [or Eyes Wide Shut] was like nothing else before or since." QT isn't Kubrick, but he has an original vision and that counts for a lot.
I liked this quite a lot, and probably like it more than any of his other movies (I think True Romance is his best script) - mainly because of the first scene and the scene in the tavern. They are well written, smart, and full of tension.
I really can't say. I mean, I enjoyed parts of it, but in retrospect, I think it just went on for too long. I'd have to watch it again, but I've got things to do.
So I guess that's a 'no', then.
I've always thought of movies as either art (like Alien) or not art (like Aliens).
I definitely don't go along with that. It's all art, but we can divide it up by kind and quality.
Right. I don't mean it literally. Some films just seem to have more of an emphasis on... i don't how else to say it than being 'artistic', instead of a fun to watch commercial enterprise. Avatar is art like every movie, but its priorities were commercial. It was made in order to earn a shit ton of money. Watch Plinkett's review for more on that.
It's like when Francis Ford Coppola introduced Apocalypse Now (at Cannes, i think), trying to explain how seriously he took it and how much effort went into it, he said "This film isn't a movie, it's a film." (The funny part was the French guy sitting next to him translated it as "This film isn't a film, it's a film." They don't really have a word for 'movie' in France.) I couldn't find a clip of him saying that but i did find him saying "the future is electronic" at 00:40. Years before Lucas! I miss you, '70s Coppola.
I wouldn't want all movies to be like this but i wish there were more of them. It's well made and well acted. To me, nothing about it is slipshod and 'mixtape' talk is a little unfair. It's more original than that.
It doesn't have the flow of some earlier stuff because it's more European, which is ok. The milk farmer scene's slow on purpose. Not like the end of Pulp Fiction where it's full of tension because Jules explains his philosophy, it's just plain slow at the beginning cuz it wants to be the opposite of Transformers 2. I enjoyed the performances of Christoph Waltz, Diane Kruger and Mélanie Laurent in a different way than Sam Jackson, Bruce Willis and Uma Thurman but just as much.
The revenge ending is too fucked up for me. Not a huge fan of Death Proof because of the revenge angle also. I disagree Zarban, there is no "why." This is an alternate universe story. The American solders are weird because they've never existed like this, and in what-if-Jews-shot-Hitler-in-the-face world that nazi doesn't get to live a cushy life in Long Island without Jewish Brad Pitt carving a swastika on his forehead first.
I've always thought of movies as either art (like Alien) or not art (like Aliens). Not art isn't necessarily a bad thing, in fact i usually prefer to watch Aliens. One of the reasons I like Basterds is because it's art. The Hurt Locker didn't deserve to sweep best picture/director/orig screenplay over this.
Martin Scorsese sez: "[Stanley Kubrick's] films were initially misunderstood. Then, after five or ten years came the realisation that 2001 or Barry Lyndon or The Shining [or Eyes Wide Shut] was like nothing else before or since." QT isn't Kubrick, but he has an original vision and that counts for a lot.
Hmm. Where to begin. Firstly I, nor my esteemed colleague Dorkman, has a problem with a scene that is slow paced. I LOVE the Milk Farmer's scene, and it stands my favorite in the movie. But there is something to be said for both pacing and resource allocation. QT's main problem is that he is the biggest fan of his own material. That's not a slam against him, nor an accusation of egoism, he just loves his reference points so much and has an unbridled enthusiasm for what he does. The trade off is that many of his scenes are self indulgent, even if it's something that makes the scene work. The slow burn of tension works perfect with the Milk Farmer, but goes a few beats too long in the German bar. He could maintain what works in that scene with just a tad bit of self restraint (which, sadly, now that Sally Menke is gone, I honestly don't know if he's going to have any).
Also, I think its a false choice that movie has to be Inglourious Basterds or Transformers 2. Believe it or not, there is plenty of real estate between those two landmarks, and there are several ways to navigate scenes in IB so that they don't resemble spazzy robots.
As for your assertion that films are either Art or Not Art, I call shenanigans. Alien is art. Aliens is Art. Citizen Kane is art. Birdemic is art. Godfather is art. The Room is art. It may be bad art, but that is completely subjective. Think of the worst film you know and I guarantee there is someone so far up that movie's ass they can extrapolate all sorts meaning and symbolism from it. It may seem silly to you or I, but the only difference in what makes a movie artful or not is personal preference and supposition. I have seen so called art films and I have seen pure popcorn entertainment, and while my opinions vary, you can't strip the title of art away from one and not the other. I have, sadly, watched the entire Cremaster Cycle and I have, thankfully, watched all of the Jean Claude movies where there are multiple Jean Claude's (Double Impact, Timecop, Replicant) and damned if I can't tell a bit of difference.
In regards to the Scorcese quote, the reason that time somehow reveals genius, isn't because audiences somehow become smarter, it's because society changes, and the things we as a society seek changes. Take American Beauty (please!), In 1999 all sorts of critics slobbered over the cinematic knob of that fucking thing (myself included, in all of my college smugness) and hailed Alan Ball as the next Yates. Well, a 9/11, two wars, an economic collapse and 4 Twilight Books later, our society has changed significantly. So much so that I doubt a movie about fussy suburban malaise could even get made now. As such...how many times do you pop in American Beauty just to watch it? IB may indeed get more love from folks as years go on. But if it does, it won't be because people will suddenly, "get it." It will be because as our generation ages and the next generation matures, that society may find something relevant or reflective in what is going on in the world.
Again, I like the movie, and you certainly are entitled to think its unmitigated genius. But it's not injustice that not everyone else sees it that way.
It was just a weird, totally amoral revenge fantasy dreamed up by a 9-year-old.
How did you feel about Kill Bill? That description fits it perfectly, but Kill Bill is better received by most people.
"And then... they kill Hitler!" Um. How do you square that with the history books? "What? Hitler is dead, right?" Right, but we know this isn't how he died. "I haven't read any history books. I'm only nine."
You mean something happened in a movie that didn't happen in real life? Unheard of!
I LOVE the Milk Farmer's scene, and it stands my favorite in the movie. ... The slow burn of tension works perfect with the Milk Farmer, but goes a few beats too long in the German bar.
As for your assertion that films are either Art or Not Art, I call shenanigans. Alien is art. Aliens is Art. Citizen Kane is art. Birdemic is art. Godfather is art. The Room is art. It may be bad art, but that is completely subjective.
I love all the scenes not featuring Brad Pitt. It's not that I don't like Brad Pitt, but--and I know I've said this here before--he's in a Sergeant Rock comic book movie, and Sergeant Rock was mostly pretty stupid. However, the bar scene could have used a trim.
Regarding art, you've got yer high art, yer pop art, and yer commercial trade. What fits where is largely subjective, but I guarantee there are plenty of film makers happy to tell you that they do not make art. They make commercial films, and that's fine. For the most part, I don't need to be more enlightened about the human condition.
/Well along into my new screenplay for 911: Dial M for Mega Snake
How did you feel about Kill Bill? That description fits it perfectly, but Kill Bill is better received by most people.
You mean something happened in a movie that didn't happen in real life? Unheard of!
Kill Bill is great. It has a stated morality--the Bride kills those who betrayed and tried to murder her. That's a great anti-hero--a character who does things that are illegal and perhaps even immoral, but who is nevertheless sympathetic and perhaps even admirable. I didn't get any of that from Brad Pitt.
Re: reality... my suspension of disbelief becomes more strained the closer the work of fiction approaches yet differs from my personal experience without an explanation. Go ahead and use your magic beans, but you have to have a character explain "These beans are magic; here is what they do" even if that's done really casually and subtly with a lot of ellipsis that relies on (for example) the viewer's cultural understanding of fairy tales.
It would be different if the film was called "What if...?" or featured a radio report of the Germans carpet bombing Washington, DC. That sort of thing would signal that all bets are off and raise the tension at the end. It would make us wonder, "Wow. What was it that made this history diverge from ours? Was a weird, glowing briefcase involved?" Something like that could have been really cool.
You probably would have liked it better with a framing sequence, like in The Wizard of Oz where we find it was a dream where as in the book it was real. Maybe we discover it was a grandfather telling the kids what he did during the war. Or a fake title card where we learn this is from a recently discovered un-produced 1942 script. Because that's what I think this is, a war time movie where the actors get to win all the victories the actual military at the time isn't doing yet.
(haven't seen the movie yet, just going by the reports)
You probably would have liked it better with a framing sequence, like in The Wizard of Oz where we find it was a dream where as in the book it was real. Maybe we discover it was a grandfather telling the kids what he did during the war. Or a fake title card where we learn this is from a recently discovered un-produced 1942 script. Because that's what I think this is, a war time movie where the actors get to win all the victories the actual military at the time isn't doing yet.
(haven't seen the movie yet, just going by the reports)
WoOz didn't actually need the frame story, because the twister explains the travel to a magical land where anything goes. I hate movies where it's all a dream anyway; if it's only my point of view that's skewed, then there's no point to the story. It's like making a movie about an optical illusion. "Oh, the lines really ARE the same length."
However, your idea of a lost script is 100% better than QT's no attempt at explaning or even foreshadowing at all. Personally, I would prefer some sci fi explanation, like Pitt and crew stumbling across a scientist who explains that the Germans just exploded a "probability bomb" or something in hopes of changing their chances of winning the war. "Says here that without the in-- indoosed time anom-- anom-a-lee, the Allies would win the war in 1945 and Hitler would shoot himself in his bunker in Berlin. Jesus, the fuckin' Nazzis blew up the FUTURE! You know what this means, boys? We gotta win this war any way we can!"
/Suddenly contemplating a new Asylum screenplay for 10 Vainglorious Bastards.
I will say this before I outline my views on the movie- I MIGHT just be retarded. Like, bear that in mind, I'm aware that everybody seems to disagree with me on all of this. But I like, can't even begin to imagine how DIF people didn't love Inglorious Basterds.
Like, it's perfect. I love everything about it. I think the premise is easy to understand and solid. I think every single character was performed brilliantly and even bit players were there because their part added to the whole. I think it delivered an interesting ending to every subplot all wrapped up neatly in a bow. And while I know many were expecting a more actiony movie, I think the action it delivered had balls and some amazing (loud) sound design.
Again, I might be retarded. I'm not a QT fan really at all, I walked out of a room once that had real life boobs in it and my first viewing of Pulp Fiction, because I wasn't really terribly interested in either. Otherwise though, I like the same things as most of you and agree with the general consensus on most things. So if I AM just retarded, and it's obvious to the rest of you, let me slide on this one.
I thought it was good, but I like pretty much everything Tarantino has done. I thought IB was kinda middle of the road for Tarantino, but that's still generally better than most other movies that come out.
I even liked Death Proof.
But I seem to like his lesser-liked movies more than his more popular ones. I'd watch Jackie Brown before Pulp Fiction. I preferred the second Kill Bill to the first one. I guess I'm just into slower flicks.
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