Just finished trucking through season 1 of Shameless. Great show. It's shot and edited extremely well, and Joan Cusack is brilliant and hilarious (as well as everybody else in the ensemble cast).

James McAvoy was one of the original cast members of Shameless UK.

The Gallaghers are a highly dysfunctional working class family headed by an alcoholic father but it is the oldest daughter who has to keep things together.

Last edited by Jimmy B (2013-12-24 21:08:12)

The intriguing (and funny) thing about it is that these people have no sense of morality or integrity, and will do whatever it takes to get out of a bind, no matter how immoral it is. They even get the little kids in on their schemes, and more often than not, they get away with it. Shamelessly.

I'll have to check out the UK version, thanks.

You have my interest.

Not watching much TV right now, just waiting for Walking Dead to come back and the next season of House of Cards.

I'm in the same boat. Tho I'm awful at finishing the things I started and have gotten a bit sidetracked after a few episodes :P

Quite enjoying American Horror Story at the moment. Just started firefly after 3 failed attempts - decided in the end to just skip the train robbery one and enjoying it much more.

Wow.  Man, I could not possibly disagree more.  I think The Train Job is one of the finest pieces of television writing I've ever seen.  You've got an unusual sci-fi world to establish, 9 characters to introduce who already know each other (so no "I'm the captain.  What do you do?" conversations), plus you've actually got to tell a story, and you've got 42 minutes.  Every second of that show is doing at least double duty, and usually triple duty. 

Plus, and pardon me a sec while I get my asbestos suit on, I think that Fox was right about Mal.  There's a quote I have stuck in my head attributed to Joss Whedon, but if it's not, it certainly sounds to me like something he would say -- "You have to earn the right to go to the dark place".  And I think that applies to Mal's character.  To my mind, he's more engaging as a lead character with the shift in tone.  Then when you see those flashes of the soul in torment, or when things start getting a little darker later in the series (and not even that much later), they resonate more. 

And the guest stars in The Train Job are all amazing.  Adelai Nishka is a great villain, and Michael Fairman is terrific.  Gregg Henry hits just the right note of forceful dignity.  So many great lines.  "I've got a vision of it not being me.  Let's do the thing."  "You've got the - the light from the console... keep you, lift you up. They shine like...little angels..." "Yes, precisely. Only the exact phrase I used was 'don't.'" "Oh, I get it! I'm good. Best thing for everyone. I'm right there with ya."

Man, I gotta go watch it again right now....

The Train Job is maybe a little clunky as an introduction when contrasted to the pilot, but I still think it's a very fun heist story after you get past the first five minutes or so. And it's got one of the absolute best moments in the entire series, a perfectly timed subversion of a tired serial trope:

See, even there I would disagree in a way.  Sure if you've got 84 minutes instead of 42, in a sense it can't fail to introduce the characters better.  But The Train Job is just unspeakably efficient. 

Look at just the scene in the bar, which isn't even the whole teaser:  you've got some kind of multicultural frontier setting (they're in a Western-looking bar, but there's a Middle Eastern belly-dancer, Mal speaks (swears?) in what sounds like Chinese).  The belly-dancer passes Mal a note, so there's something secretive going on.  Mal is established as being sort of light-hearted (the banter with Zoe and the loss of the game), but at the same time has some kind of strong undercurrent of belief in his opposition to whatever "unification" was, since he can't just let slide what the loud-mouthed, drunk guy says.  He's slightly sarcastic, a clever and somewhat ruthless fighter, principled.  In short, instantly likeable in a Han Solo sort of way. 

Zoe is clearly some kind of more straight-laced loyal sidekick, and there's a military dimension, since she refers to Mal as "Captain" and later "sir", in contrast to Jayne who relates to Mal much more informally.  Mal and Zoe have some kind of long-serving understanding, since she knows exactly how Mal is going to deal with the drunk guy. 

Jayne seems to have some kind of slightly unreliable younger brother thing going on.  When they get into trouble, his reaction is "hey, I didn't fight in no war.  Best o' luck, though." and outside the bar Mal says "hey, is Jayne even...?!?" ('fighting', or 'with us' presumably)  but then we see he's taking on like 5 guys at once, so he's clearly a great fighter and loyal at the end of the day.

Geez, how much more do you want for your 3 minutes?      And the whole rest of the episode is like that.

Efficiency is fine, but only if I can get a sense of the characters and why I should care. Train Job is not one where I felt I understood the world enough to care. Heck, I think Ariel did a better job for me and getting me in to Firefly, but I have a bent towards medical stories

It is a common term used but I'll throw it out there: stakes. Serenity establishes the stakes, the desperation of the crew rather than just getting a job, only to discover it doesn't jive with Mal's sense of honor. Train Job works better, for me, after seeing Serenity.